Genos2006-07-11 04:29:45
Here are my current tests with it...
I really don't think it should be working that way!
CODE
3060h, 3240m, 2700e, 10p, 14200en, 13398w esSixdbp-testing
You raise a mental bar around your mind.
3060h, 3240m, 2550e, 10p, 14200en, 13354w esSxdb-
Psionic Channels:
  Substratus:  Open.
  Superstratus: Open.
  Id:          Closed for 5 seconds.
3060h, 3240m, 2550e, 10p, 14200en, 13354w esSxdb-
You feel the Id channel open again.
3060h, 3240m, 2550e, 10p, 14200en, 13360w esSixdb-testing
You raise a mental bar around your mind.
3060h, 3240m, 2400e, 10p, 14200en, 13316w esSxdb-
Psionic Channels:
  Substratus:  Open.
  Superstratus: Open.
  Id:          Closed for 5 seconds.
3060h, 3240m, 2400e, 10p, 14200en, 13316w esSxdb-
You feel the Id channel open again.
3060h, 3240m, 2400e, 10p, 14200en, 13322w esSixdb-testing
You raise a mental bar around your mind.
3060h, 3240m, 2250e, 10p, 14200en, 13272w esSxdb-
Psionic Channels:
  Substratus:  Open.
  Superstratus: Open.
  Id:          Closed for 5 seconds.
3060h, 3240m, 2250e, 10p, 14200en, 13272w esSxdb-
You feel the Id channel open again.
testing
3060h, 3240m, 2250e, 10p, 14200en, 13284w esSixdb-
You raise a mental bar around your mind.
3060h, 3240m, 2100e, 10p, 14200en, 13234w esSxdb-
Psionic Channels:
  Substratus:  Open.
  Superstratus: Open.
  Id:          Closed for 6 seconds.
3060h, 3240m, 2100e, 10p, 14200en, 13234w esSxdb-
You feel the Id channel open again.
3060h, 3240m, 2100e, 10p, 14200en, 13246w esSixdb-testing
You raise a mental bar around your mind.
3060h, 3240m, 1950e, 10p, 14200en, 13196w esSxdb-
Psionic Channels:
  Substratus:  Open.
  Superstratus: Open.
  Id:          Closed for 6 seconds.
3060h, 3240m, 1950e, 10p, 14200en, 13196w esSxdb-
You feel the Id channel open again.
testing
3060h, 3240m, 1950e, 10p, 14200en, 13208w esSixdb-
You raise a mental bar around your mind.
3060h, 3240m, 1800e, 10p, 14200en, 13158w esSxdb-
Psionic Channels:
  Substratus:  Open.
  Superstratus: Open.
  Id:          Closed for 6 seconds.
3060h, 3240m, 1800e, 10p, 14200en, 13158w esSxdb-
You feel the Id channel open again.
3060h, 3240m, 1800e, 10p, 14200en, 13170w esSixdb-testing
You raise a mental bar around your mind.
3060h, 3240m, 1650e, 10p, 14200en, 13120w esSxdb-
Psionic Channels:
  Substratus:  Open.
  Superstratus: Open.
  Id:          Closed for 6 seconds.
3060h, 3240m, 1650e, 10p, 14200en, 13120w esSxdb-
You feel the Id channel open again.
3060h, 3240m, 1650e, 10p, 14200en, 13126w esSixdb-testing
You raise a mental bar around your mind.
3060h, 3240m, 1500e, 10p, 14200en, 13082w esSxdb-
Psionic Channels:
  Substratus:  Open.
  Superstratus: Open.
  Id:          Closed for 7 seconds.
3060h, 3240m, 1500e, 10p, 14200en, 13082w esSxdb-
You feel the Id channel open again.
3060h, 3240m, 1500e, 10p, 14200en, 13088w esSixdb-testing
You raise a mental bar around your mind.
3060h, 3240m, 1350e, 10p, 14200en, 13038w esSxdb-
Psionic Channels:
  Substratus:  Open.
  Superstratus: Open.
  Id:          Closed for 7 seconds.
3060h, 3240m, 1350e, 10p, 14200en, 13038w esSxdb-
You feel the Id channel open again.
testing
3060h, 3240m, 1350e, 10p, 14200en, 13050w esSixdb-
You raise a mental bar around your mind.
3060h, 3240m, 1200e, 10p, 14200en, 13000w esSxdb-
Psionic Channels:
  Substratus:  Open.
  Superstratus: Open.
  Id:          Closed for 7 seconds.
3060h, 3240m, 1200e, 10p, 14200en, 13000w esSxdb-
You feel the Id channel open again.
3060h, 3240m, 1200e, 10p, 14200en, 13012w esSixdb-testing
You raise a mental bar around your mind.
3060h, 3240m, 1050e, 10p, 14200en, 12962w esSxdb-
Psionic Channels:
  Substratus:  Open.
  Superstratus: Open.
  Id:          Closed for 7 seconds.
3060h, 3240m, 1050e, 10p, 14200en, 12962w esSxdb-
You feel the Id channel open again.
3060h, 3240m, 1050e, 10p, 14200en, 12974w esSixdb-testing
You raise a mental bar around your mind.
3060h, 3240m, 900e, 10p, 14200en, 12930w esSxdb-
Psionic Channels:
  Substratus:  Open.
  Superstratus: Open.
  Id:          Closed for 8 seconds.
3060h, 3240m, 900e, 10p, 14200en, 12930w esSxdb-
You feel the Id channel open again.
testing
3060h, 3240m, 900e, 10p, 14200en, 12942w esSixdb-
You raise a mental bar around your mind.
3060h, 3240m, 750e, 10p, 14200en, 12892w esSxdb-
Psionic Channels:
  Substratus:  Open.
  Superstratus: Open.
  Id:          Closed for 8 seconds.
3060h, 3240m, 750e, 10p, 14200en, 12892w esSxdb-
You feel the Id channel open again.
3060h, 3240m, 750e, 10p, 14200en, 12904w esSixdb-testing
You raise a mental bar around your mind.
3060h, 3240m, 600e, 10p, 14200en, 12854w esSxdb-
Psionic Channels:
  Substratus:  Open.
  Superstratus: Open.
  Id:          Closed for 8 seconds.
3060h, 3240m, 600e, 10p, 14200en, 12854w esSxdb-
You feel the Id channel open again.
3060h, 3240m, 600e, 10p, 14200en, 12866w esSixdb-testing
You raise a mental bar around your mind.
3060h, 3240m, 450e, 10p, 14200en, 12816w esSxdb-
Psionic Channels:
  Substratus:  Open.
  Superstratus: Open.
  Id:          Closed for 9 seconds.
3060h, 3240m, 450e, 10p, 14200en, 12822w esSxdb-
You feel the Id channel open again.
3060h, 3240m, 450e, 10p, 14200en, 12834w esSixdb-testing
You raise a mental bar around your mind.
3060h, 3240m, 300e, 10p, 14200en, 12784w esSxdb-
Psionic Channels:
  Substratus:  Open.
  Superstratus: Open.
  Id:          Closed for 9 seconds.
3060h, 3240m, 300e, 10p, 14200en, 12784w esSxdb-
You feel the Id channel open again.
3060h, 3240m, 300e, 10p, 14200en, 12796w esSixdb-testing
You raise a mental bar around your mind.
3060h, 3240m, 150e, 10p, 14200en, 12746w esSxdb-
Psionic Channels:
  Substratus:  Open.
  Superstratus: Open.
  Id:          Closed for 9 seconds.
3060h, 3240m, 150e, 10p, 14200en, 12746w esSxdb-
You raise a mental bar around your mind.
3060h, 3240m, 2550e, 10p, 14200en, 13354w esSxdb-
Psionic Channels:
  Substratus:  Open.
  Superstratus: Open.
  Id:          Closed for 5 seconds.
3060h, 3240m, 2550e, 10p, 14200en, 13354w esSxdb-
You feel the Id channel open again.
3060h, 3240m, 2550e, 10p, 14200en, 13360w esSixdb-testing
You raise a mental bar around your mind.
3060h, 3240m, 2400e, 10p, 14200en, 13316w esSxdb-
Psionic Channels:
  Substratus:  Open.
  Superstratus: Open.
  Id:          Closed for 5 seconds.
3060h, 3240m, 2400e, 10p, 14200en, 13316w esSxdb-
You feel the Id channel open again.
3060h, 3240m, 2400e, 10p, 14200en, 13322w esSixdb-testing
You raise a mental bar around your mind.
3060h, 3240m, 2250e, 10p, 14200en, 13272w esSxdb-
Psionic Channels:
  Substratus:  Open.
  Superstratus: Open.
  Id:          Closed for 5 seconds.
3060h, 3240m, 2250e, 10p, 14200en, 13272w esSxdb-
You feel the Id channel open again.
testing
3060h, 3240m, 2250e, 10p, 14200en, 13284w esSixdb-
You raise a mental bar around your mind.
3060h, 3240m, 2100e, 10p, 14200en, 13234w esSxdb-
Psionic Channels:
  Substratus:  Open.
  Superstratus: Open.
  Id:          Closed for 6 seconds.
3060h, 3240m, 2100e, 10p, 14200en, 13234w esSxdb-
You feel the Id channel open again.
3060h, 3240m, 2100e, 10p, 14200en, 13246w esSixdb-testing
You raise a mental bar around your mind.
3060h, 3240m, 1950e, 10p, 14200en, 13196w esSxdb-
Psionic Channels:
  Substratus:  Open.
  Superstratus: Open.
  Id:          Closed for 6 seconds.
3060h, 3240m, 1950e, 10p, 14200en, 13196w esSxdb-
You feel the Id channel open again.
testing
3060h, 3240m, 1950e, 10p, 14200en, 13208w esSixdb-
You raise a mental bar around your mind.
3060h, 3240m, 1800e, 10p, 14200en, 13158w esSxdb-
Psionic Channels:
  Substratus:  Open.
  Superstratus: Open.
  Id:          Closed for 6 seconds.
3060h, 3240m, 1800e, 10p, 14200en, 13158w esSxdb-
You feel the Id channel open again.
3060h, 3240m, 1800e, 10p, 14200en, 13170w esSixdb-testing
You raise a mental bar around your mind.
3060h, 3240m, 1650e, 10p, 14200en, 13120w esSxdb-
Psionic Channels:
  Substratus:  Open.
  Superstratus: Open.
  Id:          Closed for 6 seconds.
3060h, 3240m, 1650e, 10p, 14200en, 13120w esSxdb-
You feel the Id channel open again.
3060h, 3240m, 1650e, 10p, 14200en, 13126w esSixdb-testing
You raise a mental bar around your mind.
3060h, 3240m, 1500e, 10p, 14200en, 13082w esSxdb-
Psionic Channels:
  Substratus:  Open.
  Superstratus: Open.
  Id:          Closed for 7 seconds.
3060h, 3240m, 1500e, 10p, 14200en, 13082w esSxdb-
You feel the Id channel open again.
3060h, 3240m, 1500e, 10p, 14200en, 13088w esSixdb-testing
You raise a mental bar around your mind.
3060h, 3240m, 1350e, 10p, 14200en, 13038w esSxdb-
Psionic Channels:
  Substratus:  Open.
  Superstratus: Open.
  Id:          Closed for 7 seconds.
3060h, 3240m, 1350e, 10p, 14200en, 13038w esSxdb-
You feel the Id channel open again.
testing
3060h, 3240m, 1350e, 10p, 14200en, 13050w esSixdb-
You raise a mental bar around your mind.
3060h, 3240m, 1200e, 10p, 14200en, 13000w esSxdb-
Psionic Channels:
  Substratus:  Open.
  Superstratus: Open.
  Id:          Closed for 7 seconds.
3060h, 3240m, 1200e, 10p, 14200en, 13000w esSxdb-
You feel the Id channel open again.
3060h, 3240m, 1200e, 10p, 14200en, 13012w esSixdb-testing
You raise a mental bar around your mind.
3060h, 3240m, 1050e, 10p, 14200en, 12962w esSxdb-
Psionic Channels:
  Substratus:  Open.
  Superstratus: Open.
  Id:          Closed for 7 seconds.
3060h, 3240m, 1050e, 10p, 14200en, 12962w esSxdb-
You feel the Id channel open again.
3060h, 3240m, 1050e, 10p, 14200en, 12974w esSixdb-testing
You raise a mental bar around your mind.
3060h, 3240m, 900e, 10p, 14200en, 12930w esSxdb-
Psionic Channels:
  Substratus:  Open.
  Superstratus: Open.
  Id:          Closed for 8 seconds.
3060h, 3240m, 900e, 10p, 14200en, 12930w esSxdb-
You feel the Id channel open again.
testing
3060h, 3240m, 900e, 10p, 14200en, 12942w esSixdb-
You raise a mental bar around your mind.
3060h, 3240m, 750e, 10p, 14200en, 12892w esSxdb-
Psionic Channels:
  Substratus:  Open.
  Superstratus: Open.
  Id:          Closed for 8 seconds.
3060h, 3240m, 750e, 10p, 14200en, 12892w esSxdb-
You feel the Id channel open again.
3060h, 3240m, 750e, 10p, 14200en, 12904w esSixdb-testing
You raise a mental bar around your mind.
3060h, 3240m, 600e, 10p, 14200en, 12854w esSxdb-
Psionic Channels:
  Substratus:  Open.
  Superstratus: Open.
  Id:          Closed for 8 seconds.
3060h, 3240m, 600e, 10p, 14200en, 12854w esSxdb-
You feel the Id channel open again.
3060h, 3240m, 600e, 10p, 14200en, 12866w esSixdb-testing
You raise a mental bar around your mind.
3060h, 3240m, 450e, 10p, 14200en, 12816w esSxdb-
Psionic Channels:
  Substratus:  Open.
  Superstratus: Open.
  Id:          Closed for 9 seconds.
3060h, 3240m, 450e, 10p, 14200en, 12822w esSxdb-
You feel the Id channel open again.
3060h, 3240m, 450e, 10p, 14200en, 12834w esSixdb-testing
You raise a mental bar around your mind.
3060h, 3240m, 300e, 10p, 14200en, 12784w esSxdb-
Psionic Channels:
  Substratus:  Open.
  Superstratus: Open.
  Id:          Closed for 9 seconds.
3060h, 3240m, 300e, 10p, 14200en, 12784w esSxdb-
You feel the Id channel open again.
3060h, 3240m, 300e, 10p, 14200en, 12796w esSixdb-testing
You raise a mental bar around your mind.
3060h, 3240m, 150e, 10p, 14200en, 12746w esSxdb-
Psionic Channels:
  Substratus:  Open.
  Superstratus: Open.
  Id:          Closed for 9 seconds.
3060h, 3240m, 150e, 10p, 14200en, 12746w esSxdb-
I really don't think it should be working that way!
Tervic2006-07-11 04:54:39
QUOTE(Genos @ Jul 10 2006, 09:29 PM) 306458
Here are my current tests with it...
(Id testing stiuff)
I really don't think it should be working that way!
(Id testing stiuff)
I really don't think it should be working that way!
Why not? A simplified psychology definition of the Id is the unconscious resivoir of mental energy, so if your resivoirs of psychic energy (I don't get why it'd be ego and not mana, but whatever) are lower, it'd make sense for your id to be weaker too, and IRE is representing it as a longer id balance. Neat, I like it.
Unknown2006-07-11 04:57:20
I must admit, I don't really understand why all the psionics revolve around ego. It seems a mental skill, not a personality one.
Unknown2006-07-11 05:04:30
QUOTE(Avaer @ Jul 10 2006, 11:57 PM) 306467
I must admit, I don't really understand why all the psionics revolve around ego. It seems a mental skill, not a personality one.
ego
1. The self, especially as distinct from the world and other selves.
2. In psychoanalysis, the division of the psyche that is conscious, most immediately controls thought and behavior, and is most in touch with external reality.
3.
1. An exaggerated sense of self-importance; conceit.
2. Appropriate pride in oneself; self-esteem.
Unknown2006-07-11 06:55:04
Right. Ego has many more, and deeper, meanings than simply one's sense of worth and/or pride and arrogance.
Unknown2006-07-11 07:03:48
QUOTE(Genos @ Jul 11 2006, 04:15 AM) 306456
You scan for psionicists in the local area and find: Ixchilgal, Telrath, Lyco,
You will your mind to open itself up to the sixth sense.
You raise a mental bar around your mind.
They sound more like mental abilities to me, rather than anything to do with projection or sense of self. I suppose it could be argued that some psychic abilities would tax your personal charm and magnetism and perhaps leave you in danger of your personality being subsumed amid others... but certainly not those ones.
Do all channels/abilities rely on charisma?
Unknown2006-07-11 07:05:39
QUOTE(Avaer @ Jul 11 2006, 02:03 AM) 306512
They sound more like mental abilities to me, rather than anything to do with projection or sense of self. I suppose it could be argued that some psychic abilities would tax your personal charm and magnetism and perhaps leave you in danger of your personality being subsumed amid others... but certainly not those ones.
Do all channels/abilities rely on charisma?
ego
1. The self, especially as distinct from the world and other selves.
2. In psychoanalysis, the division of the psyche that is conscious, most immediately controls thought and behavior, and is most in touch with external reality.
3.
1. An exaggerated sense of self-importance; conceit.
2. Appropriate pride in oneself; self-esteem.
Unknown2006-07-11 07:10:45
I read your quoted definition, please don't be obtuse. Obviously I don't find two words a convincing argument that completely justifies every psionic ability using ego and charisma. Besides, I can quote as well.
Charisma
1. A rare personal quality attributed to leaders who arouse fervent popular devotion and enthusiasm.
2. Personal magnetism or charm: a television news program famed for the charisma of its anchors.
3. (Christianity.) An extraordinary power, such as the ability to perform miracles, granted by the Holy Spirit.
4. a personal attractiveness that enables you to influence others
I take it we're using the christian definition of charisma as regards psionics? Otherwise it doesn't make much sense.
Edit: Ok, found a better explanation for why ego could be used as psychic power
The ego, super-ego, and id are the divisions of the psyche according to psychoanalyst Sigmund Freud's "structural theory". The id contains "primitive desires" (hunger, rage, and sex), the super-ego contains internalized norms, morality and taboos, and the ego mediates between the two and may include or give rise to the sense of self.
Ego
In Freud's theory, the ego mediates between the id, the super-ego and the external world. Its task is thus to find a balance between primitive drives, morals and reality. Its main concern is with the individual's safety, and allows some of the Id's desires to be expressed, but only when consequences of these actions are minimal.
Although in his early writings Freud equated the ego with the sense of self, he later began to portray it more as a set of psychic functions such as reality-testing, defence, synthesis of information, intellectual functioning, and memory.
The word ego is taken directly from Latin where it is the nominative of the first person singular personal pronoun and is translated as "I myself" to express emphasis.
Super-ego
The super-ego is a symbolic internalization of the father figure and cultural regulations. The super-ego tends to stand in opposition to the desires of the id because of their conflicting objectives, and is aggressive towards the ego. The super-ego acts as the conscience, maintaining our sense of morality and the prohibition of taboos. Its formation takes place during the dissolution of the Oedipus complex and is formed by an identification with and internalization of the father figure after the little boy cannot successfully hold the mother as a love-object out of fear of castration. "The super-ego retains the character of the father, while the more powerful the Oedipus complex was and the more rapidly it succumbed to repression (under the influence of authority, religious teaching, schooling and reading), the stricter will be the domination of the super-ego over the ego later on — in the form of conscience or perhaps of an unconscious sense of guilt" (The Ego and the Id, 1923). The concept of super-ego has been subject to criticism for its sexism. Women, who are considered to be already castrated, do not identify with the father, and therefore form a weak super-ego, apparently leaving them susceptible to immorality and sexual identity complications. In Freud's work Civilization and Its Discontents (1930) he also discusses the concept of a "cultural super-ego".
Id
The id ("das Es", cf. Latin id, English it, German es) is the psychical system "which behaves as though it were the Unconscious", or the "dynamically unconscious repressed", in effect, the reservoir of need-gratification impulses such as the primitive instinctual drives of sexuality and aggression. Freud believed that the id is inborn, operating on the dynamics of the primary process mode of thinking. The drives of the id are said to work according to the pleasure principle, requiring immediate gratification or release without concern for external exigencies. Though hunger itself may be seen as a pure id desire, the crying of the hungry infant is already an instinctive attempt to relate, that is, to communicate that need to the object of the drive in question, namely, one who can help to satisfy that need. Thus drives are linked to object relations, as Freud observed in his 1895 essay "Project for a Scientific Psychology".
Alright.
QUOTE
Charisma
1. A rare personal quality attributed to leaders who arouse fervent popular devotion and enthusiasm.
2. Personal magnetism or charm: a television news program famed for the charisma of its anchors.
3. (Christianity.) An extraordinary power, such as the ability to perform miracles, granted by the Holy Spirit.
4. a personal attractiveness that enables you to influence others
I take it we're using the christian definition of charisma as regards psionics? Otherwise it doesn't make much sense.
Edit: Ok, found a better explanation for why ego could be used as psychic power
QUOTE(Wikipedia)
The ego, super-ego, and id are the divisions of the psyche according to psychoanalyst Sigmund Freud's "structural theory". The id contains "primitive desires" (hunger, rage, and sex), the super-ego contains internalized norms, morality and taboos, and the ego mediates between the two and may include or give rise to the sense of self.
Ego
In Freud's theory, the ego mediates between the id, the super-ego and the external world. Its task is thus to find a balance between primitive drives, morals and reality. Its main concern is with the individual's safety, and allows some of the Id's desires to be expressed, but only when consequences of these actions are minimal.
Although in his early writings Freud equated the ego with the sense of self, he later began to portray it more as a set of psychic functions such as reality-testing, defence, synthesis of information, intellectual functioning, and memory.
The word ego is taken directly from Latin where it is the nominative of the first person singular personal pronoun and is translated as "I myself" to express emphasis.
Super-ego
The super-ego is a symbolic internalization of the father figure and cultural regulations. The super-ego tends to stand in opposition to the desires of the id because of their conflicting objectives, and is aggressive towards the ego. The super-ego acts as the conscience, maintaining our sense of morality and the prohibition of taboos. Its formation takes place during the dissolution of the Oedipus complex and is formed by an identification with and internalization of the father figure after the little boy cannot successfully hold the mother as a love-object out of fear of castration. "The super-ego retains the character of the father, while the more powerful the Oedipus complex was and the more rapidly it succumbed to repression (under the influence of authority, religious teaching, schooling and reading), the stricter will be the domination of the super-ego over the ego later on — in the form of conscience or perhaps of an unconscious sense of guilt" (The Ego and the Id, 1923). The concept of super-ego has been subject to criticism for its sexism. Women, who are considered to be already castrated, do not identify with the father, and therefore form a weak super-ego, apparently leaving them susceptible to immorality and sexual identity complications. In Freud's work Civilization and Its Discontents (1930) he also discusses the concept of a "cultural super-ego".
Id
The id ("das Es", cf. Latin id, English it, German es) is the psychical system "which behaves as though it were the Unconscious", or the "dynamically unconscious repressed", in effect, the reservoir of need-gratification impulses such as the primitive instinctual drives of sexuality and aggression. Freud believed that the id is inborn, operating on the dynamics of the primary process mode of thinking. The drives of the id are said to work according to the pleasure principle, requiring immediate gratification or release without concern for external exigencies. Though hunger itself may be seen as a pure id desire, the crying of the hungry infant is already an instinctive attempt to relate, that is, to communicate that need to the object of the drive in question, namely, one who can help to satisfy that need. Thus drives are linked to object relations, as Freud observed in his 1895 essay "Project for a Scientific Psychology".
Alright.
Shamarah2006-07-11 11:32:54
Id is supposed to work like that, check AB PSIONICS CHANNELS.
Unknown2006-07-11 12:25:54
QUOTE(Avaer @ Jul 11 2006, 12:57 AM) 306467
I must admit, I don't really understand why all the psionics revolve around ego. It seems a mental skill, not a personality one.
I'm going with... game balance, or diversity of skills. Perhaps said people are using mana for other things while they're attacking, and this set-up lets them use ego as well at the same time, thus spreading their damage out and being less suseptable to instakills on both ends. On the other hand it might be so high cha races have an outlet rather then high int races getting all the fun.
Oh, and sub super and ID all work on their own timers, seperate from eq, if anyone hasn't heard about that by now.
Sylphas2006-07-11 12:29:05
High int races aren't all that important. To mages, I guess. Guardians and Wiccans don't often damage kill, and mana isn't really a problem. Look at Amaru; he kicked ass as a 10 int Lobo.
Shamarah2006-07-11 12:31:02
I dunno. I went lobo and I do wish I had a higher int; it'd be good to be able to damage-kill once I get an inquisition without having to set up a soulless for it first.
Unknown2006-07-11 12:33:22
QUOTE(Sylphas @ Jul 11 2006, 02:29 AM) 306524
High int races aren't all that important. To mages, I guess. Guardians and Wiccans don't often damage kill, and mana isn't really a problem. Look at Amaru; he kicked ass as a 10 int Lobo.
That's because Celestines are less about speed and/or damage and more about timing. Timing everything out to set up an Inquisition to kill with Soulless for example. His speed and damage didn't matter in that case, all that mattered was being extremely tanky while setting up the timing on the kill.
Moondancers don't have that luxury, Hexes require speed. Mugwump is practically necessary.
Sylphas2006-07-11 13:56:44
Mugwump aren't hugely intelligent either, they're just fast. And I make due just fine as a Furrikin, even though I'll probably never kill a top-tier powergaming fighter.
Genos2006-07-11 14:50:16
QUOTE(Tervic @ Jul 11 2006, 12:54 AM) 306466
Why not? A simplified psychology definition of the Id is the unconscious resivoir of mental energy, so if your resivoirs of psychic energy (I don't get why it'd be ego and not mana, but whatever) are lower, it'd make sense for your id to be weaker too, and IRE is representing it as a longer id balance. Neat, I like it.
I know what Id and such means I've studied it enough already it's not the definition I'm talking about. I don't believe I've ever seen any skill depend on how much of a certain number you have and I was confused. However, looking at AB PSIONICS CHANNELS I see that is indeed the way it is usupposed to work. I just thought I read somehwere that Id is based on your charisma but apparently I'm mistaken.
Anyways, I'm not sure I really like it that way but is it unique. However, I'm wondering if the time of Id actually depends on your amount of ego or just what percentage of your max ego you have. For example if your max ego was something like 600 as a novice would it be extremely slow or would it scale down as you use more and more ego? Does anyone know?
Geb2006-07-11 16:24:54
QUOTE(Genos @ Jul 11 2006, 03:50 PM) 306547
I know what Id and such means I've studied it enough already it's not the definition I'm talking about. I don't believe I've ever seen any skill depend on how much of a certain number you have and I was confused. However, looking at AB PSIONICS CHANNELS I see that is indeed the way it is usupposed to work. I just thought I read somehwere that Id is based on your charisma but apparently I'm mistaken.
Anyways, I'm not sure I really like it that way but is it unique. However, I'm wondering if the time of Id actually depends on your amount of ego or just what percentage of your max ego you have. For example if your max ego was something like 600 as a novice would it be extremely slow or would it scale down as you use more and more ego? Does anyone know?
It is based on your current ego, not your max. The closer you are to your personal max when you use Id, the lower the recovery time will be. So what I would try to do is use Id first in my combos, minimizing my recovery time (The absolute minimum is 4 seconds).
Shamarah2006-07-11 16:41:45
QUOTE(geb @ Jul 11 2006, 12:24 PM) 306561
It is based on your current ego, not your max. The closer you are to your personal max when you use Id, the lower the recovery time will be. So what I would try to do is use Id first in my combos, minimizing my recovery time (The absolute minimum is 4 seconds).
You sure about that minimum? I remember it being faster than sub if you have a really high ego.
Geb2006-07-11 17:14:50
QUOTE(Shamarah @ Jul 11 2006, 05:41 PM) 306566
You sure about that minimum? I remember it being faster than sub if you have a really high ego.
That is what I got from all of my tests at different ego maximums from 3 to 6k. When my ego was exactly at its max, I had a recovery as fast as sub. When it went a bit under, I had a recovery of 5 seconds. So on and so forth.
Narsrim2006-07-11 18:14:31
Speaking of attacks, I'd like to highlight an interesting problem that envoys definately need to discuss: resistances available to certain damage sources and wtf is happening.
Using the magic source as an example, consider some of the best case scenarios: A Krokani Paladin, a Furrikin Aquamancer Psionist, an Orlach Ur'guard, etc. etc. etc.
=================================================
Krokani Paladin Magic defenses:
1. Magic skillset
2. Robes with a magic proof
3. Resistance in Athletics
4. Draconis in Rituals
5. Magic resistance via Benediction
6. Numen (short term, I realize)
7. Racial resistance (level 3)
When I tested this Grom a while back (who didn't have trans Magic), I was hitting for under 100 damage with numen up and under 200 damage with no numen while I had -22- INT. Using less extreme examples, I had Urazial (Furrikin Blacktalon without trans Magic) tank 36 violets in a row while in Dreamform, only sapping my health every 3-4.
=================================================
Here's a log that I think proves how terrible it can be. Please do not look at the raw numbers in this case, but consider percentages because the target has huge health:
At this time, I had 18 int which is decent with the buffs change.
SOLL:
- Level 83, Igasho Paladin.
+ magic proofed robes
+ level 2 racial resistance to magic
+ resistance in Athletics
+ draconis in Rituals
+ magic resistance from benediction
+ NO magic skillset (inept)
----------
5188h, 5752m, 4906e, 10p, 27660w exkdb<>-
declare soll
You declare your intent to bear arms against Soll.
5188h, 5752m, 4906e, 10p, 27660w exkdb<>-
moonburst soll
You thrust your palm towards Soll and a burst of silver light shoots out from it burning into Soll, who cries out in pain.
5188h, 5608m, 4906e, 10p, 27640w xkdb<>-
Soll tells you, "910."
5188h, 5608m, 4906e, 10p, 27652w xkdb<>-
You have recovered equilibrium.
5188h, 5608m, 4906e, 10p, 27652w exkdb<>-
5188h, 5608m, 4906e, 10p, 27660w exkdb<>-
discern soll
You stare deep into Soll's soul and discern that:
Soll's health stands at 7144/8054.
Soll's mana stands at 2167/2201.
Soll's ego stands at 4735/4735.
Soll's power stands at 10/10.
5188h, 5383m, 4906e, 10p, 27650w exkdb<>-
(910 damage/8054 max health) = ~11% max health
Sparkleberry ALONE heals 10% max health/mana/ego so with regenerations, a single sparkleberry more or less nullifies a moonburst. As a human, my moonburst speed is 4.0 seconds. Sparkleberry balance is roughly 5.5 seconds thus he could more or less indefinately tank my moonburst WITHOUT sipping if he webbed or shielded once every 60 seconds or so...
NOW just imagine if he was a Krokani and had trans magic... it is just silly..
EDIT:
This is with me wielding my athame too btw, which is supposed to make moonburst/nightkiss/etc stronger.
EDIT 2:
And I realize people will say that in cases like these, Wiccans/Guardians should go for absolve/wrack/toadcurse, but the problem is that such is not viable against every opponent. Wiccans, for example, have 2 methods to kill a target. I don't understand why one of those methods has to be utterly worthless.
EDIT 3:
Without surge:
discern soll
You stare deep into Soll's soul and discern that:
Soll's health stands at 6734/6734.
Soll's mana stands at 3303/3303.
Soll's ego stands at 4735/4735.
Soll's power stands at 10/10.
You thrust your palm towards Soll and a burst of silver light shoots out from it
burning into Soll, who cries out in pain.
5188h, 5383m, 4906e, 10p, 27640w xkdb<>-
Soll tells you, "825."
5188h, 5383m, 4906e, 10p, 27646w xkdb<>-
You have recovered equilibrium.
5188h, 5383m, 4906e, 10p, 27646w exkdb<>-
discern soll
You stare deep into Soll's soul and discern that:
Soll's health stands at 5909/6734.
Soll's mana stands at 3303/3303.
Soll's ego stands at 4735/4735.
Soll's power stands at 10/10.
This brings the damage up to 12% in a situation where toadcurse isn't as viable, which is nowhere near as bad as it could be because if Soll had trans magic, it'd be a bit less.
Using the magic source as an example, consider some of the best case scenarios: A Krokani Paladin, a Furrikin Aquamancer Psionist, an Orlach Ur'guard, etc. etc. etc.
=================================================
Krokani Paladin Magic defenses:
1. Magic skillset
2. Robes with a magic proof
3. Resistance in Athletics
4. Draconis in Rituals
5. Magic resistance via Benediction
6. Numen (short term, I realize)
7. Racial resistance (level 3)
When I tested this Grom a while back (who didn't have trans Magic), I was hitting for under 100 damage with numen up and under 200 damage with no numen while I had -22- INT. Using less extreme examples, I had Urazial (Furrikin Blacktalon without trans Magic) tank 36 violets in a row while in Dreamform, only sapping my health every 3-4.
=================================================
Here's a log that I think proves how terrible it can be. Please do not look at the raw numbers in this case, but consider percentages because the target has huge health:
At this time, I had 18 int which is decent with the buffs change.
QUOTE
SOLL:
- Level 83, Igasho Paladin.
+ magic proofed robes
+ level 2 racial resistance to magic
+ resistance in Athletics
+ draconis in Rituals
+ magic resistance from benediction
+ NO magic skillset (inept)
----------
5188h, 5752m, 4906e, 10p, 27660w exkdb<>-
declare soll
You declare your intent to bear arms against Soll.
5188h, 5752m, 4906e, 10p, 27660w exkdb<>-
moonburst soll
You thrust your palm towards Soll and a burst of silver light shoots out from it burning into Soll, who cries out in pain.
5188h, 5608m, 4906e, 10p, 27640w xkdb<>-
Soll tells you, "910."
5188h, 5608m, 4906e, 10p, 27652w xkdb<>-
You have recovered equilibrium.
5188h, 5608m, 4906e, 10p, 27652w exkdb<>-
5188h, 5608m, 4906e, 10p, 27660w exkdb<>-
discern soll
You stare deep into Soll's soul and discern that:
Soll's health stands at 7144/8054.
Soll's mana stands at 2167/2201.
Soll's ego stands at 4735/4735.
Soll's power stands at 10/10.
5188h, 5383m, 4906e, 10p, 27650w exkdb<>-
(910 damage/8054 max health) = ~11% max health
Sparkleberry ALONE heals 10% max health/mana/ego so with regenerations, a single sparkleberry more or less nullifies a moonburst. As a human, my moonburst speed is 4.0 seconds. Sparkleberry balance is roughly 5.5 seconds thus he could more or less indefinately tank my moonburst WITHOUT sipping if he webbed or shielded once every 60 seconds or so...
NOW just imagine if he was a Krokani and had trans magic... it is just silly..
EDIT:
This is with me wielding my athame too btw, which is supposed to make moonburst/nightkiss/etc stronger.
EDIT 2:
And I realize people will say that in cases like these, Wiccans/Guardians should go for absolve/wrack/toadcurse, but the problem is that such is not viable against every opponent. Wiccans, for example, have 2 methods to kill a target. I don't understand why one of those methods has to be utterly worthless.
EDIT 3:
Without surge:
QUOTE
discern soll
You stare deep into Soll's soul and discern that:
Soll's health stands at 6734/6734.
Soll's mana stands at 3303/3303.
Soll's ego stands at 4735/4735.
Soll's power stands at 10/10.
You thrust your palm towards Soll and a burst of silver light shoots out from it
burning into Soll, who cries out in pain.
5188h, 5383m, 4906e, 10p, 27640w xkdb<>-
Soll tells you, "825."
5188h, 5383m, 4906e, 10p, 27646w xkdb<>-
You have recovered equilibrium.
5188h, 5383m, 4906e, 10p, 27646w exkdb<>-
discern soll
You stare deep into Soll's soul and discern that:
Soll's health stands at 5909/6734.
Soll's mana stands at 3303/3303.
Soll's ego stands at 4735/4735.
Soll's power stands at 10/10.
This brings the damage up to 12% in a situation where toadcurse isn't as viable, which is nowhere near as bad as it could be because if Soll had trans magic, it'd be a bit less.
Sylphas2006-07-11 18:58:07
It's not a reliable test, but I tried it out just to see what happened. Furrikin, fully deffed (Drawdown, Aura, Maiden blessings), magic proofed robe: Nature curse does 76 damage. In comparison, KICK did 78. Moonburst was under 300. I have inept Magic, and was being attacked by a High Elfen.
Shamarah's symbol hits me for under 300 damage. Inquisition wore off and I was still yellow, with no regeneration or sipping or berries.
Shamarah's symbol hits me for under 300 damage. Inquisition wore off and I was still yellow, with no regeneration or sipping or berries.
