Those situations were both Seren to Seren. Remember that back then, the entire Ethewilde was Serenwilde territory. It isn't anymore. You don't get autoenemied for empressing someone to the prime Pool of Stars who is already in the city of Celest, because it's org territory to org territory. On Celestia, only the nexus room is org territory. The rest is Celestia.

EDIT: Ninjaed by Charune

I know what you meant by this (and perhaps the wording was just not carefully chosen), but you still have to deal with enemy druid demesnes on Ethereal.

Ok so we have proven that Maelstrom isn't really on par with Pollute, correct? And proofing doesn't do that much to help, especially since it can cause extra damage on 9/18 of the races in the basin, so lets say its even lvl1 fire or electric disadvantage.... now proofing helps a little bit, (not sure how much exactly but what 5%-10%?)

Now take a level 2 or level 3 disadvantage to fire/elect..... it is going to crush that player. With or without proofings.

Pollution, no class even has a lvl 1 disadvantage... so basically it cannot be boosted against any race in the game. But some skillsets can help defend against it slightly.... but they are at no disadvantage to it.

So, am I wrong in saying that Maelstrom is a much more powerful skill than Pollution? And since they are supposed to be the equivilant of one another, that something is wrong? And no, I do not mean an exact duplicate of one another, but for 10 power for both skills, one seems way better than the other, when they should be equally scary to have done to you...

I just don't think this is justifiable in any way really... but anyways, back to the snow plowing...... (it's cold outside)

Ildaudid, you do realize what the term "tests inconclusive" means, right? Forren, against someone who was completely undeffed, did about twice the damage of Fury with Maelstrom. Forren, against someone who was completely deffed, did about the same damage as Fury with Maelstrom.

When I have time, I'll do a series of controlled tests to determine why the skills are working so weirdly, and where the bug is if there is a bug. The fact that fury ignores armor is the weirdest bit of all of this (not that I'm complaining), but the fact that fury does half the damage of maelstrom against an undeffed target is very, very strange.

ANNOUNCE NEWS #687
Date: 12/11/2006 at 0:48
From: Roark Libertas
To : Everyone
Subj: Warrior Changes, Part 2

A few changes loaded just now:
+ Charging will not bypass rubble.
+ Fracturing a skull is a swing instead of jab.
+ Snap rib replaces break chest for Axelord, cured by arnica on the
chest. Causes bleeding on balance/armbalance loss, might slow EQ a bit too, I forget what we decided
+ Sever phrenic replaces puncture lung for Pureblade, cured by smoking
myrtle. 33% chance of smoking failing with no message. For flavour, causes 100 endurance loss on balance loss, and the breathing lightly from moving too fast effect.
+ Execute replaces roundhouse in Axelord. 5p Instakill if head, chest, and gut are wounded enough (two locations at heavy, one at critical)
+ Furrow brow replaces scalp in Pureblade, cured by sanguine purgative. (And yarrow, it seems) - causes heavy bleeding and blindness every 8s starting 4s from the afflict. More initial bleeding than scalp, but a bit less over time.
+ Collapse lung and crush chest in Pureblade and Axelord no longer
require the lesser chest affliction to be caused, but the wound level
was raised to critical. Note that this nerfs CollapseLungs to be only regen-cured asthma for PBs, since it doesn't cover up the PunctureLung affliction for them, and thus doesn't carry over the PunctureLung effect. This makes the skill worthless, but it was impossible to afflict with before, so I guess it's somehow better now.

Penned by My hand on the 6th of Urlachmar, in the year 164 CE.


Testing with Fury, Maelstrom, and Pollute 99% done, will post the results soon.

Will someone do me a favor? (to prevent me from bothering the envoys in the game)

Suggestion: to make figurines mainstream, reduce what it takes to make them.

Current requirements: 2 powerstones, 1 gold, 2 marble, 12.5% power

Suggested requirements: 1 powerstone, 1 gold, 1 marble, 5% power

Results of Fury, Pollute, and Maelstrom testing:

All tests on 3796 health with no racial resistances.


Pollute - not int modified

2761 - undeffed - gifted resilience
2208 - snake and gifted resilience

2877 - undeffed - inept resilience
2301 - snake and inept resilience

2157 - projected damage at trans resilience
1726 - projected damage at trans resilience + snake

Maelstrom - not int modified

2768 - undeffed
2696 - fire proofing
2660 - frost potion
2624 - electric+fire proofing
2624 - Splendor proofings (note the oddity with this? Splendor robes are supposed to give double proofings, and do for every other skill)
2516 - frost, splendor proofings
1941 - frost, hold breath
1797 - frost, splendor proofings, hold breath


Fury - not int modified, ignores worn armor

2761 - undeffed - gifted resilience
2877 - undeffed - inept resilience
0 - when a Rune of Absorption does it's thing

2070 - projected damage with barkskin and gifted resilience
2157 - projected damage with barkskin and inept resilience
The above are just guesses, as I was testing on a Serenguard warrior. Against Forren: 3156 without stoneskin, 2398 with stoneskin, making stoneskin give 25% resistance, and I would assume barkskin is the same way.

2157 - projected damage with trans resilience
1618 - projected damage with trans resilience + bark/stoneskin


What all this means:

Resilience can give up to 25% resistance to cutting, blunt, and poison damage at trans. This means that trans resilience massively decreases the damage of both Pollute and Fury. Fury is only further resisted by draconis, barkskin, stoneskin, numen, and putre. Pollute is only further resisted by snake totem (which half the game gets) and some crow/night skills, dunno which. Maelstrom is effected by frost potion, fire proofing, electric proofing, elemental spiritshields, and hold breath.

Resilience doesn't effect Maelstrom, but the fact that hold breath does makes up for that. Trans resilience is 25% resist for the others, hold breath is 25% resist for maelstrom.

So, to me, if I really had 3796 health on the real server),
Pollute takes me from 3796 to 1588 (2208 damage).
Fury takes me from 3796 to 1726 (2070 damage).
Maelstrom takes me from 3796 to 1999 (1797 damage) if I am paying attension, and from 3796 to 1280 (2516 damage) if I'm being an idiot and not holding my breath just before it hits.

At omni-ultra-super-trans, they would do
Pollute: 1726 damage
Fury: 1618 damage, except when blocked by a Rune of Absorption
Maelstrom: 1797 damage


The only change that is needed is that Fury needs to not be blocked by Runes of Absorption. I find the skills to be otherwise sufficiently balanced.

Also, critique should probably not take power if it fails.

OH NOES MAELSTROM IS STILL TEH UBER OP!!!! NERF!!!!

Umm making it worthless makes it better for who? I haven't used it yet, but I here they took away endurance and of course the ab file still says this.... With a collapsed pair of lungs, not only will there be regular blackouts but also the complete inability to smoke.

Even though it has never given nor will give blackout.




I guess, it should be tested more Shorlen, or more data given... I just know how much I was hit for... and how insane it was. And at that time Forren wasn't even a titan, nor do I think he was GC or anything.



Sorry Gandal, your post seems to scream: "It's past my bedtime and I still have no clue what I am talking about, so I will just say something stupid again before my mommy turns off my computer and tucks me in for the night."


So, good night little man, I hope you slept well and dreamt of sugar plum fairies and all the little toys you will have under your tree soon....

Taking the information from your results you have just proven that malestrom is the best.

Your results prove that malestrom is the best, it does the most damage on a neutral target who is stopping their offence and slowing down their hinderance to hold breath, if that target were to be caught without hold breath on, which is very likely then malestrom does even more damage then the other two. And this is on a neutral target not taking into account that malestrom targets some of the most common elemental weaknesses.

On the results you give currently malestrom is by far the best of the three.

You swing a darkened greataxe of precious metal at Ferlas. You howl in rage and cleave right through her, severing bone, flesh and tendons in a fell swoop as your a darkened greataxe of precious metal sweeps out her back in a gory crimson spray. She stares blankly at you in surprise as bloody spittle gurgles from her lips.
Ferlas topples messily to the ground, cloven in twain.

Spiffy deathline.

You should get a trophy for it like when you pull off a behead.

You should get two. The left half of Ferlas lies here in a pool of blood. The right half of Ferlas lies here in a pool of blood. :snicker:

It's easy enough to spot a maelstrom and hold breath though. The hindrance in doing so is a more than fair compensation for the state of the mage + demesne post usage.

That dosn't change the fact that it makes it better than the other two, I have to stop my offence to make malestrom the same if slightly more damage than pollute/furry. With furry/pollute theres no need to stop your offence. Again it dosn't take into account racial weakness either.

Ok. *shrug* So Maelstrom is marginally better than pollute. Do we really care? It doesn't make much difference.

That's a typo. CollapseLungs NEVER gave blackouts. The BM version gives the endurance drain of PunctureLung, since they're stuck with PunctureLung until CollapseLungs is cured. That's what that line is supposed to read.


Are you an idiot? Sorry, but I'm rather pissed that I spend three entire hours testing the nuances of those three skills only to have you ignore what I wrote and just say I didn't test it enough. Let me explain in simpler terms.

Fury, Maelstrom, and Pollute.
Only depend on max health.
And resistances.
They are not effected by int.
They are not effected by artifacts that increase damage.
They are not effected by int.
They are not effected by champion staves.
(They are all effected by war blessings though, for the record.)

Fury, Maelstrom, and Pollute do the same damage to an undeffed target.
Trans resilience provides 25% resistance to Fury and Pollute.
Expert discipline provides 25% resistance to Maelstrom.

Non-warriors/bards have 25% additional resistance to Fury. (Unless Draconis is in Rituals? Then I guess everyone except bards and commune warriors have 25% resistance to Fury)
Commune members have 20% additional resistance to Pollute.
Everyone has 10% additional resistance to Maelstrom. Some other classes get further resistance.

This makes Maelstrom, against a bunch of omnitrans folks, the best, and Maelstrom, against a standard group of half skilled and half unskilled fighters, the worst.


For those who say you can't hold breath at the right time, are you that bad at coding?

#trigger {^Towering waves roll across the waters, reaching to impossible heights and} {}
#cond {forming watery figures of monstrous sea creatures.$} {#alarm +7 {hold breath}} "" {within|param=1}

Is that really so hard to write? (the skill takes 12 seconds to hit, going first message->4secs pass->second message->8secs pass->effect.


However, I will agree that Maelstrom is the hardest to resist. To put Maelstrom in line with the other two, I recommend making the 25% unblockable damage into 25% magic damage. This would allow most people to get 20% resistance to Maelstrom beyond the 25% from hold breath, similar to Pollute and Fury.

However, I do not think this is necessary. You can time pollute to hit at the same time as the damage from the geo demesne. Revan did it. It left me with 200 health out of 3796. Granted, I had zero resilience at the time (having forgot it as part of the test), but still - it did significantly more than maelstrom could have done. Fury can be timed with druidic effects as well, though I haven't tested that out yet. I'd say Pollute is by far the most scary, since the geo can both time Pollute with his effects, and boulderblast just as it hits.

Fury is the weakest, though by a rather insignificant amount. Just make runes of absorbtion not block the skill, and it's fine.

Also, remember that I was taking into account Snake Totem, since so many people have it. Celestians don't though, and thus will be taking 20% more damage than listed. To use the numbers above,

At omni-ultra-super-trans, they would do:
Pollute: 2157 damage
Fury: 1618 damage, except when blocked by a Rune of Absorption
Maelstrom: 1797 damage
assuming no defence aganist poison beyond trans resilience.

Why are so many Magnagorans complaining?


I actually disagree, as I have said above. I find Pollute to be the strongest, especially in the hands of a competant geo who can time effects well. Oh, and you want to cast Pollute exactly one second before your damage effects would hit - trying to cast it exactly two seconds before your damage effects would hit is too chancy, as Revan discovered. Best to keep that one second margin of error.

Great work Shorlen for testing all that stuff!

For your benefit, dear Shorlen, I will rephrase.



I was not commenting on your post in any way. I was attempting to say: Even if you're right Ferlas/Ildaudid.. does it matter enough to change it?

Anyway, good work etc.