I understand the issues involved here and I still think that its going overboard way too quickly to write off the trees as a security breach 100% of the time. Some trees will have to be mulched, yes. But that doesn't mean that the trees themselves are bad and also doesn't mean that they all need to be replaced immediately either.

Also, this is getting to sound more and more like a newspost I'd write to the guild board but anyway, if the commune is mulching trees happily, the responsibility is on the Hartstone. If no druid makes pains to explain why those trees shouldn't be mulched, where they come from, why having them isn't bad, etc. then of course we'll have people singing the praises of hacking them down.

This blurs into a somewhat seperate rant I've had for a while. The nature roleplay in Serenwilde is pretty skin-deep. It may not even get that deep either. I could go on and on but meh, I've got to track down Zootv on dvd for a good price before I pass out.

Nice.

No more Pooka'ing people to Focus Spirit..

No more easy Toadcurse..

Sad face, but oh well!

If they resist and hinder you while you're trying to defend your own home territory, that may not be the same as "evil", but it's certainly justifiable RP to replace them.

I think you are talking about two different levels of "replacing them."


One level is "those are evil, they are abominations, destroy them wherever you see one"

The other level, which I hope you are talking about is the "those hinder me, I'll remove them in places that I often have battles"

I know a lot of people who will say, "They might hinder me, they're a security risk, we can't allow them in our territory," which amounts to the same thing in the end. And the people who already think they're bad and tainted, of which there are more than a few, will have a damned good point to add to their arguments.

Saplings are still evil. I wish mages had them

Burn them! Chop them all down! Bring down every tree!

Obviously the moral of the story is don't come up with interesting RP in the seren, it always comes back to bite you in the ass during the next update of what's camp. 'Omg darling, you’re still wearing fae? fae fur suits are SO last year! Get with the times girl-friend, the new hot items are these tree-bark hand bags, with matching bark rings, and bark eyelash extensions!'

Hrm, I have a sudden desire to read The Lorax. Poor Truffula Tree's.

Remember watching The Lorax is Grade 9 in my Geography class, so we'd understand a child's version of deforestation.

And I'm not going to give up on the trees. Not yet anyways, it'll take completely blocking my melds for that to happen. And no silly Moonies, Guard, bitter Hartstone or Bards are going to change that.

The update didn't really have anything to do with RP, it was for balance. People have been asking for trees to affect opposing druids for longer than I can remember, but for every change that goes in, there are several people who will complain about it.

I, for one, think the change was needed. You can build your RP, but Lusternia is not a freeform RPG. You have to mold your RP around the world we live in. Glomdoring and Serenwilde serve oppositional forces; it didn't make much sense to be able to have a Hartstone demesne easily spread through a wyrden sapling. It should (from an IC and OOC perspective) be the way it is now.

Absolute . Until this change, there was absolutely no difference between Hartsone and Blacktalon saplings. Blacktalon saplings are not tainted, not wyrden, and no different than any other tree. Blackthorn even grows in the Serenwilde natively. Then this change comes along, and they obviously are different now, and the most reasonable suspect is, of course, wyrd. GG interesting forest RP.

And you know, it WAS balanced. It affected both sides equally. If you can somehow find something to smoke that makes you think that's imbalanced, lemme have a hit.

City VS. City conflict still has to realitycheck... Communes have no way to stop instant unmeld (excluding bard illusionary terrain) with this change they can remove illusionary terrain from bards now, to stop uber-druid demesnes compared to cities. (Not that I like the RP basis of the change, perhaps make it so saplings just have to be influenced to support Hartstone/Blacktalon demesnes..)

There are more than two sides. It did NOT effect all four sides equally - and it still does not, but it's closer. They should effect other druids at least somewhat; they were designed to make the demesne harder to break. That's the OOC perspective, which makes perfect sense to anyone who's ever seen druids fight over a demesne during village influence.

Also, the whole point is that there should be a difference between Blacktalon and Hartstone sapligs. Hartstone and Blacktalon are very different. Their demesnes are different, and the very fact that the Blacktalon use the sapling to protect the hold of the wyrd on the land suggests that they are in fact touched by the wyrd, and so should not be so easily transformed to be natural. That's the IC side, which also makes perfect sense.

Of course, the people arguing over this are not even druids. Perhaps we should speak with them, before jumping all over the admin for implementing exactly what they have been asking for.

Dylara is a Druid...

Technically this doesn't stop anyone from instantly unmelding, does it? The way I understand it you can fill it with locusts or whatever instantly, it just takes you a lot longer to regain equilibrium. So it takes you longer to create you own meld, but not to break someone else's.

And honestly illusory terrain only makes a difference if you're breaking melds by yourself. In raiding situations there's also someone to realitycheck for me, so it's move/realitycheck/forcetaint as quickly as possible and lag is the only reason it's any different from move/forcetaint.

Wow, you're quick.

Anyway, I was referring to Wesmin and Sylphas, who raised the bigger arguments. I'd be interested to hear the thoughts of the druids who fight pretty regularly and whether they think this will address the issues that were around before. I didn't really read a lot of complaints in what Dylara was saying, she was simply suggesting that she'd rather go with the RP that the trees aren't inherently bad and shouldn't be destroyed - which is a perfectly fair and doable Rp perspective as well.

*chuckle* I made a single funny post in light of the situation, not really 'a bigger argument', my character hasn't really gotten into the issue much, other then to pass along that the nymph's didn't like the trees being cut down in faethorn (ages ago), as long as the woodland spirits are still happy and safe he's happy to leave the trees up to the tree tenders.

The people who are most concerned about the change are all former Hierophants: Sylphas, Anarias, and Dylara, and I think they have an intrinsic right to be concerned about where this leads the Hartstone.

Except that Sylphas has been Hartstone GM in the past I would think that that would count for something.

I don't really get what the problem is with the tree thing. It's not like we can't still acknowledge that in and of themselves they're ok while not letting them in the forest because of security issues.

Shiri, the wilde is a quagmire, and there is always someone waiting to jump on circumstances to spin the direction of the country to what they believe it should be. That is why they are concerned. Hrm, this makes me extra glad I didn't contest GM like a bunch wanted me to.